Nerve injury after estim

[scoopi]

So I have been wanting to ask this because from my last estim experience I took away a permanent pain in my genital area. I assume that some nerves have been injured by the current. I don't understand how it happened though. This condition has not healed completely by itself for several years actually an caused me tremendous misery.
From what I understand from forums like these everything should have been fine though and I totally did not see this coming. Maybe someone has heard of this before and knows how to explain it.
The device I used was a DaveyBox variant (LINK REMOVED). I did some measurements with a 1kOhm resistor and found it to have maximum output of about 20V/20mA. Usual stimming I did was probably more at 10V/10mA. I usually used conductive rubber loops in various places as electrodes. I also tried to amp up a buttplug with silver foil but it didn't work very well.
So I wonder if anyone can relate to this. Thanks!

[admin]

Injury from e-stim is very unusual and is normally quite minor (irritation is more common), and generally very hard to if not impossible to quantify, especially over long periods of time. The body does recover from most injuries in quite a short period, so to have issues lasting years would probably indicate a more underlying issue, but I'm not medically qualified, and would suggest you chat to your physician.

Davy boxes and similar home made units always have one big issue, the fact they have not been tested again recognised standards means unless you know exactly what you are doing to have an increased safety risk, which is why we never recommend such devices.

Si

[scoopi]

And what would such standard tests and means be?

[admin]

CE and UKCA certification for product and electrical safety is a good start, together with adherence to BS (Now EN) 60601-15 which covers TENS units, which is the closest definition to e-stim products that have an actual safety protocol.

I'd also ask if the creators/designers have product and public liability insurance.... they dont.

Because of the liability issues, this one of the reasons we don't allow discussion of the construction of such devices on this forum.

Si

[scoopi]

Ok, thankyou, that seems understandable. I still dont see the difference though. I dont have access to these standards. But I know that TENS operates at f.ex. very short duty cycles and comparatively low frequencies. I still found someone over on reddit who claimed he damaged nerves on his penis with such a device and took several years to recover. And the 2B also has a continuous mode and supports external audio. So maybe it is just something that few people experience.

[admin]

The standard exist so companies can test to ensure things are genuinely safe. unfortunately home made units don't have that level of assurity, and E-Stim used incorrectly with unknown equipment can cause damage.

As an example, just because its described as continuous, does not mean DC. the nuances are far greater. All of our E-stim equipment create AC, with pulsed waveforms which make up the various modes and sensations. We have been professionally producing E-Stim for the last 19 years as a job, and probably produce more dedicated made for play e-stim units in the world than anyone else, so we possibly know a little about what we talk about.

Sadly Reddit and the internet in general is not the greatest place to gain insight into E-Stim its too easy to write a few words and suddenly become an 'expert' based on a mis understanding the technology and techniques involved. Many people make assumptions about our designs based on internet posts, normally made by some disgruntled individual, and people wonder where all the conspiracies theories come from..

Si

[scoopi]

I guess you do know things about these devices. It is beyond the options of this place to discuss the details of DIY powerboxes. For reasons of basic physics however people believe that they don't put out DC. I made some measurements on my box and even if I have a significant DC offset in the audio feed I can barely find DC in the output. The signal is < 1mV. A nerve impulse has a delta V of about 110 mV. Even if I assume that this measurement is within the accuary of my multimeter (which it isn't probably) I am not convinced that that is what did the damage. It seems very low in comparison to natural physiological states. So it might have been something else.

[scoopi]

So how does your audio mode work? I hear it filters certain frequencies. What signal strength do you get from it?

[admin]

So how does your audio mode work? I hear it filters certain frequencies. What signal strength do you get from it?

Thats called thread hijacking .And what do you mean by signal strength? Generally we don't discuss the internal workings of our audio modes.

Si